One of the common refrains you hear from the poutragers is that President Obama doesn't listen to them. Perhaps there's a reason for that. And right now we're witnessing a perfect example of why.
For months now the theme coming from them is that President Obama needs to "draw some lines in the sand" to stimulate the economy, protect entitlements, and increase taxes on the wealthy.
Well guess what? He's doing just that with his American Jobs Act and the proposal he will unveil this morning on deficit reduction.
True to form, Republicans are accusing the President of class warfare and he's taking all kinds of heat over it from a few Democrats.
So where are the voices of all these folks who have been saying this is what they want him to do? We know they can rally their troops when their goal is to "kill the bill" because they don't like what is being proposed for health care reform. We know they can organize petitions to try to stop the President from gutting Medicare and Medicaid (which he never proposed). And we know they can organize boycotts of OFA and the DNC because things aren't moving fast enough on the repeal of DADT.
But where are they when he's actually doing what it is they say they want? Are there petition drives on their front pages? Or calls to contact members of Congress to push them for support?
Nada.
You'd almost think they only know how to do opposition, wouldn't you?
Poutragers indeed.
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Yup. These PL pretend left /poutraged left whiners are just that. They find themselves on the sidelines all the time because of their fickleness. If you can't join the firefighters, at least stop effing throwing things at them. No wonder none of the dem pols wants to touch them even with a ten-foot pole.
ReplyDeleteBut how does lumping a diverse group of people, who manifest what you're talking about to widely varying degrees, into an amorphous "them," and infantilizing them with the term "poutrage" do anything to bridge the gap?
ReplyDeleteI agree with what you're saying. The way you're saying it feels like more self-inflicted divide and conquer. Do you really believe that the language you've chosen will do anything other than raise defensiveness among the very people you need to rally?
I mean, there are ways Obama could use the Progressive Caucus of Congress to explicitly position himself to the right of very liberal elements of the Democratic Party, making visible how ridiculous the charges of "socialist" are, but instead, judging from the complaints I've heard from them, he's pretty much marginalized them, so people can't see the difference between the left and center wings of the party. Of course, I'm giving Tea Partiers too much credit for being able to grok distinctions of any sort, but it might help with some independents to see the matter more clearly.
Everyone brings something to the table. When we reach the point that we've decided "They" are a problem, we'll miss opportunities to see what value they bring to the discussion, even if "we" need to hold our ground on important differences. I don't see how deepening divides in the Democratic party is helpful to anyone aside from the Tea Party.
And, I'll just close with saying that as far as DADT repeal goes - that is just one element of a much larger picture. There was definitely a severe tone-deafness on Obama's part with regard to the GLBT community that engendered a lot of distrust. It wasn't just a matter of wanting a pony immediately.
@ dirkster42
ReplyDeleteHow about actually addressing the main point of this post - where are the 'progressive' voices on AJA ? After all the childish foot-stomping over bully pulpit crap ?
The poutraged left deserves all the scorn since they never had the grace to acknowledge what has been achieved by this admin. A case in point - your dismissive post about DADT repeal.
dirkster, I don't believe I have ever seen Smartypants or anyone else portray the Progressive Caucus of Congress as poutrages. The term is used for bloggers and the professional left (paid bloggers or media personalities) who complain about the President, but do nothing to support his policies that they say they are in favor of. While I like your point that we should not divide the Democratic party, it is the professional left, Blue Dogs, and left purity bloggers that have divided themselves off from the rest of the Democratic party. A lot of people, including myself, have had many unpleasant encounters with those bloggers just because we supported the President. I have much more peace of mind now that I've decided to focus on positive sites that are working to get progressive politicians elected. As far as DADT goes, the President said many times that he wanted it to be a law passed by congress and not an executive order because the order could be rescinded by the next administration. He wanted it to be permanent, which it is.
ReplyDeleteNevermind. I give up.
ReplyDeleteLove you smartypants, it was good seeing you again.
I'm becoming more and more convinced that conversations are impossible. I'm going to focus on writing congresspeople and parole boards, and less time on trying to build bridges through conversation. My blood pressure went down when I joined the DK boycott, and maybe I'll apply that to blogging as a whole.
ebogan63 here.
ReplyDeleteI think it's a bit of a reach to say that the poutrage crowd are in such numbers that they need to be 'rallyed' to support PBO, since most of them registered their 'dissapointment' weeks into him taking office. A large part of why PBO's messaging seems muddled, has to to with this crew continually kneecapping him at every turn, instead of focusing their ire at the Republicans
Good Morning Dirskster, your 'self-inflicted divide and conquer' reference sure woke me up. :-)
ReplyDeleteLike you, I agree with what SP is saying, but IMO the poutragers are the ones who have created, and nourished the gap and marginalized themselves. So far, all they (at least the more vocal of them) have been bringing to the table is major criticism of each step this administration takes, dating back to very early in PBO's stint. Frankly they ARE a problem because they are loud and unrelenting in their nitpicking of the President (i.e. the leader of the Democratic Party), and very sparing, even reluctant to give credit when it's obvious it's due. IMO they lack credibility; you bring value to a discussion when you can present balanced arguments AND show openness to the fact that there are different ways to solve problems. If your way is the only way,and when it's not immediately accepted your response is to yell, scream, name call or pout, then your contribution to the big picture will become extremely limited, or unwelcomed. Eventually no one will want you at the table, except maybe the opponent to whom you are supplying ammunition.
Quite frankly, I no longer believe many of these people can be 'rallied' as their shouting has been so consistently loud and bitter, shortsighted AND unfair. Nevertheless, the table is not closed, they are welcome to pull up a chair when they are ready to open their eyes and be reasonable. As this is 'a diverse group...who manifest [themselves in] widely varying degrees', there is still time for the more rational among them to realize they are hurting the big picture. Every voice is needed, so IMO it's time for the poutragers to put a lid on the criticisms and lend their voices instead to the battle ahead.
dirkster - Sorry I didn't respond sooner, I've been away from my computer for a couple of hours. And now it looks like perhaps you're gone for good. But I'll take a stab at a reply just in case.
ReplyDeleteI wonder if you have any other objections to what I wrote other than the use of the word "poutrager." I'll assume not and focus on that.
I totally understand people who have policy differences with President Obama. I actually have a few too. And so this moment is especially important to me. The question has always been whether or not his critics would be able to pivot to support when he proposed what they've wanted all along.
Now we have an answer to that question - and for too many progressive blogs its "no."
For those who have been unable to pivot - it says to me that the rift is something other than about policy. I think it has more to do with what we were talking about in another thread - they've planted their feet firmly in victim mode regardless of the policy discussion.
I hear that you don't like the fact that I called those folks a name. And perhaps you have a point. But the truth is that I want to see those folks marginalized. They are doing a good job of making themselves irrelevant (hence my title here). But to me they are part of the problem that needs to be overcome rather than part of the solution.
And let me just emphasize who I'm talking about when I say that. Its NOT people who criticize the President. Its people who ONLY know how to do that.
On the aside about DADT - President Obama deserves to be challenged about his hesitancy to embrace marriage for GLBT people. Since he has been nothing but forthright about that personal struggle, I would have hoped that people could respond by meeting him in kind to push him along. I'm glad that there are probably some people around the President who have approached it that way. I didn't see many in the progressive blogosphere who did so however.
Part of the challenge we need to face is deciding who its worth trying to talk to and when we're just beating our heads against a brick wall. I've decided the poutragers are in the later category. I NEVER assumed Obama was there on GLBT rights.
The problem is there is no such thing as timing for these people. And when there's no such thing as timing, there is not such thing as strategy, and literally every move that doesn't show Obama beating up on Republicans is dismissed as "11-dimensionsl chess." Look, I like my iphone and the internets, too. But not everything happens instantly.
ReplyDeleteI am not sure what the plan is here, other than political. Any plan Obama comes up with that includes increases in tax revenues or that is not primarily tax cuts for businesses combined with entitlement cuts will probably be rejected. The GOP has already made it clear that they have no interest in compromising. They have taken the nation hostage twice to prove it. If I were Obama, I would make no “jobs” effort. It would all be political because the only way for him to make progress on anything is to get the GOP out of control. The GOP’s Tea Party masters do not appear to be interested in solving problems. They are interested in winning.
ReplyDelete